I like this
I’ve been saying similar things for a long time now. Repulicrats and Demicrans are two sides of the same coin. Bush signed in the patriot act. I got all excited to make a change and voted for Obama. Then he signs in the expansion of the patriot act and carpet bombs the shit out of Syria.
IMO democrats aren’t really “left.” They’re more like “were going to use the federal gov to protect corporations” and then the GOP is more like “were going to use the state and local governments to protect corporations”
And then every November, Americans vote to protect corporations.
Look you’re either down to use your allotment of violence this November to fight back within the system, or you’re mad enough to fight The System, and build anew.
super secret option
Both, both is also good.
Anything else makes you a Republican Asset. Fascism is already here, and I don’t believe you can vote your way out, but there is value in getting the data to prove it. There is value in giving The Democratic Party enough rope to hang themselves with. To prove to both yourself and others that even with more power The Democratic Party will still only fight with strongly worded letters.
There is also value in pumping up the DSA faction inside the party, and helping them takeover.
There is no value in staying home, and it’s too late this election to build a Third Party Movement. So your options are either get behind Blue, or get ready to get bloody. Otherwise you’re just a whining Republican Asset.
There is also value in pumping up the DSA faction inside the party, and helping them takeover.
Just worth saying again.
There’s a lot of liberals in here thinking they’re leftists, or trying to “unify the left” in their usual bullshit ways.
Voter depression task force out and about again right in time for midterms. Man “leftists” must really love having Republicans in power.
You folk are either Russian bots, or so far brainwashed by Russian bots you’ve become indistinguishable from them.
Everyone I don’t like is a Russian bot and other fairy tales
Every single election cycle
Weird uptick of both sides bullshit the closer we get to November, go vote.
Predictable uptick
Sounds about right.
Even in this example, there is one side that is obviously far far worse than the other.
I don’t think we should really be heralding the “better” side as the ones that are going to save us. Remember their goals are ultimately the same.
Not really.
A guy standing in a room watching a rape or murder is also irredeemable scum.
Less bad than the one committing it. Maybe not “far far” but still.
I can and will argue that its just as bad. Kinda like pointing and laughing at shipwreck survivors before you leave them to drown.
There is a reason however that in such cases the law differentiates between murder and accessory to murder. The latter carries less severe penalties. They are simply not the same thing and one is objectively worse than the other.
I agree, but also don’t think we should be so devoted as to defend them for being the only ones who can help us and having them watch and do nothing. They’re more concerned with the people running on doing more. Is that an Ally or just the weaker of two enemies?
We should absolutely push the Democrats to do better and support DSA and other farther left candidates. Short term though, they are the best chance to wrest control of the government back from the MAGA fascists.
Cleaner, perhaps, but not usefully better.
It is the job of fascists to make sure any groups who might oppose them are too busy fighting each other to stop them.
Uh… no? Of course they’d love it to happen, but that’s not how fascists historically operate.
Yeah, fascists never use propaganda to twist the public’s beliefs to their benefit. /S
I’d certainly be interested in historical examples of fascist propaganda meant specifically to divide the opposition (rather than simply gain more supporters).
I mean, the historic Nazis basically presented themselves to the German political establishment as an anti-communist deal with the devil, and it worked well enough for them to take over Germany. Does that count?
I’d say not really. This deal with the devil tactic was ultimately about getting the German political establishment to support them in return for breaking communist skulls, so it falls pretty cleanly under “simply getting more supporters.” What would count would be the Nazis trying to split people who oppose them from other people who oppose them (so social democrats from liberals, communists from social democrats, etc) so that the size of the opposition isn’t changed but it’s directed less effectively. What you’re referring to is just selling oneself to potential supporters, which any political party/movement must do anyway.
Propaganda can have multiple purposes. It also drove a wedge between the far left and the center left. The same goes for the Nazis attacking LGBT people (sound familiar)?
It also drove a wedge between the far left and the center left.
No it didn’t. The people the Nazis were making deals with were squarely on the right of the German political spectrum. We’re talking monarchists, rightwing nationalists and the like. A good proxy for this would be seeing which parties voted for the Enabling Act of 1933, and as you’ll notice immediately if you’re familiar with German politics from this period they’re all rightwing. Hell, most of them weren’t even pro-democracy. The center left here was the SPD, and they all (the ones that made it to the Reichstag anyway) voted no, while the communists were too busy suffering state repression. Importantly, the wedge that was driven between these two parties was driven by themselves.
Absolutley true. Yet, you still need to vote to have any say in what’s happening. Don’t let this stop you and don’t be discouraged in criticizing either. Both are very important democratic freedoms. Voting does more than protesting. Questioning and researching make your vote wiser. Dissent defies these freedoms in many ways.
Agreed, but you should still go and vote the brainworm posse out.
This is the time of the year when accounts with a thousand post and ten comments start trying to depress the vote for the only party that has a chance to beat the republicans.
Whoops total accident
There’s a thousand criticisms of US politics I agree with, that make sense; but the one thing that has never made sense to me is why the Republican Party exists.
It’s a horrendous monster with no visible redeeming values. The Democrats can live off “We will fight the monster!” and be opportunistic scumbags, but no explanation given for why that monster exists.
As long as even some of the democrats build up a platform of fighting that monster, and have to pretend to do it, then it’s better than those monsters actually being in charge. I’m not a fan of handwaving the “hard fact” that group still continues to exist as a pure enemy of American success through today’s age, and it turns almost anything else into a lesser evil.
Mostly gerrymandering/voter suppression/corruption (they’re all the same thing, to me). The Republicans are always accusing Democrats of influencing elections, because they know how easy it is.
You can look it up yourself pretty easily: there are about 1.5x as many people who reliably vote Democratic as there are people who reliably vote Republican. The only reason Republicans ever win anything is because of baldfaced voter suppression.
The part that makes even less sense is that majority of Americans support that monster party, even after it got significantly more monstrous (maggot movement)
Republican as a party has existed for basically the same amount of time the US has. It doesn’t really have it’s own goals.
The problem is just that poor people’s voices are actively suppressed in favor of the dollar
This is why I think reforming the Democrats is a lost cause. They would rather torpedo the entire thing than give an actual leftist one iota of power.
El-Sayed / Hasan manufactured controversy playing out right now is a perfect example of what this looks like.
Consider that a lot of this is coming from campaign consultants who eschew the idea of grass roots funded lean campaigns that don’t waste money on TV ad buys(and more consultants).
Also, a lot of this is coming straight from AIPAC. Every single Democrat politician that is engaging in this character assassination spree is getting money from AIPAC.
And, since the lefty candidates tend to communicate to their base via “non traditional” means, traditional media sees them as a threat too.
The whole manufactured controversy is just Israel’s talking points. “Antisemitism” this and “no genocide” that - these aren’t real points and it’s why AIPAC incumbents are being singled out. The situation has become overly apparent that the DNC is hamstrung by foreign interests to be ineffective.
“Foreign interests”.
It’s the same interests as the “natives” ruling class. It’s not about helping Israel or the USA, it’s about money, and these interests are international. The ruling class of the USA is the same ruling class of Earth, the USA is the capital (formerly UK), and Israel is as enslaved to them as the USA, it’s not the “controller”.
it’s about money
That includes war, from primitive accumulation to the MIC. See: The Palestine Laboratory
Posts like this are designed to split the left so that the right can keep power.
I think he is splitting people are the establishment democrats who are going to fox news to attack the leftists and DSA
I’m confused as to which parts of the left it’s supposed to split. The communists and the democratic socialists? The anarchists and the worker democracy folks? The DSA from independents like Sanders?
I feel like the message of the post is more so about uniting as the left flank against pro-corporate politicians like most of the democrats and republicans.
The goal of the post is to pit the far left against he moderate left so that either one side stays home, or the other side votes with the right.
This is fucking stupid. Eliminating MAGA has to be job #1, nothing else happens until that does. MAGA needs to lose in 2028 by margins unheard of in modern elections. like 75-80% margins. Failing that, they’ll just come back with more dirty tricks…
I practice the “Vote left in EVERY election” I will always vote for the furthest left candidate no matter what. In the primary, this means voting for the DemSoc or the very liberal… But in the General it sometimes mean voting for the moderate just base don them not being MAGA…
This is the ONLY way we get control back.
The “far left” principles align with most normal people. When was the last time Hakeem Jeffries and Chuck Schumer represented your interests.
So, OPs post isn’t trying to split the party… The actions of corporate dems ARE splitting the party. Just look at “left leaning” media coverage on Mandami, El-Sayed and Angie Nixon. They are spouting the same things you are hearing on Fox News… Yet, let’s blame OP for the “split” and not the people in charge whose fault it is. I think they call that Stockholm Syndrome.
They are down voting you for speaking the truth
you either don’t believe that the liberal democratic “left” constantly attacks the real left because it endangers the status quo, or you think the real left should ignore it and still team up with them even as they do everything to weaken them.
if the first is the case, i believe you should do more research and i can post some links.
if the second, i think that’s a dumb strategy and never really worked. it’s well known that liberals always team up with the fascists in the end to protect the status quo.
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Using the phrase “game theory” when you really mean “I’ve had a bit of a think” is an antipattern, and much more transparent than you seem to think.
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Literally nobody said anything about voting.
Oh I fully believe it’s happening, but I think it’s a problem that is amplified by the right to suppress liberal turnout…and it works. Look at 2024. It fucking worked.
And it’s going to happen again in 2028 if we don’t knock it the fuck off.
Step 1 has to be the elimination of MAGA…
Step 2 through 10 involve actually fixing the system. But none of it will happen if step 1 isn’t completed FIRST.
I just don’t feel confident that it was the propaganda of the right suppressing liberal interest, and not the authentic apathy of people not finding democracy in the democratic party.
Step 1 has to be the elimination of MAGA…
I also don’t feel confident the current for of the democratic party is equipped for this, and I think not pushing them to do better is how we went from Biden to Trump 2.
Lol. Both sides.